Hi Tom. Hi Mary.

Hi Melissa.

Uhm, some friends of mine, Mark and Susanna, they went to Ireland recently, and uhm, they were showing us some of their photos and I know that both of you are from Ireland so, I thought that, uhm, maybe we could talk about some of their, places, that were in their photos. The first place, it's, uhm, a castle, I think, just outside Waterford. Have you, have you, have you ever been any castle outside Waterford?

I haven't ever been to Waterford. I just drove through it but I never stayed.

Yeah. Waterford, of course, is famous for the crystal isn’t it, isn’t it?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes.

The Waterford Crystal.

And, ehm, it's also famous for the Tramore Races. There's a race week...

Oh yeah.

...every year. Uhm, that castle...it's not the Rock of Cashel? No, that's in...

Oh, that, well...

...Tipperary.

Well, that's in here as well. Have you, you've been there? The Rock of Cashel?

Yes.

What, what kind of place is it?

It's a big, uhm, it's a monastery built on top of this Rock of Cashel.

Uh hmm.

And uh, it's always been a, a religious center.

Is it still sort of operating as a...?

Yes, they're still working there. Uhm...Tipperary is a famous county for hurling.

Oh right.

Some of the Munster finals are played in Thurles, which is also a town in Tipperary.

What was the name of the town?

Thurles.

Oh okay, 'cause actually another of their photos is one of them holding a hurling stick. But you don't call it a hurling stick do you?

No. Hurley.

Right. Did you used to play?

Yes, I played quite a bit.

I...I...

...mos, mostly in Belfast. During the war.

During the war?

Hmm.

I've never seen the game at all, I don't think.

It's rough (laughs).

(Laughs)

You use the stick to protect yourself, as well as to hit the ball.

Right.

You can get bones smashed.

Yeah.

Broken knees, broken arms.

(Laughs) so you....

It's dangerous.

You gotta be pretty tough.

Yeah, but they have, uh, straightened it out quite a bit because the players are now using helmets.

Oh really.

But when I was playing there were no helmets.

(Laughs) You just...

Hence the head damage!

Tom, Mary, Mel: (Laugh)

Uhm, is it only played in Ireland?

Well, some, uh, Irish immigrants, they play in, quite a bit in, uh, London and it's, it's very famous with the Irish people in New York and Boston.

Uh huh.

Lot of Irish people, good hurling players, go over to, to New York...

Right.

... and they play uh, a game again there. Usually the All-Ireland finalists go to New York that same year and have a replay there.

I guess they can make some money. To...is it sort of professional?

Oh yeah. Well it's mostly...

Is it professional in Ireland?

No.

No.

It's, it's one of the, the main amateur sports left because you pay your own way.

Uh hmm.

And you buy your own equipment.

So...

Did it uhm...I mean, it seems like there's no other sport in the world that's much like it? Or, or is it similar to hockey? Is it?

Well it's a little bit, uh, but there aren't nearly as many rules in hurling as there is in field hockey.

Uh, the other game is the game of Gaelic football, which is all...also played by amateurs in Ireland and, eh, Gaelic football is played with a round ball.

Oh, okay, like, like a soccer ball?

Yes.

Yes.

Yeah, so, oh not like a rugby ball?

See, soccer and field hockey and cricket...

Um hmm.

Ehm, the Gaelic Athletic Association, they run the hurling and the football. The, those three games are foreign games to the Gaelic Athletic Association because they, those games were played, eh, by the occupied forces...

Uh huh.

The British Army, in other words.

Uh huh.

So that’s why they, and they suspend uh, players that play the Gaelic games if they play the foreign games.

Oh, okay. So oh.

Do you understand that?

Yeah.

Okay.

Which, which games are considered foreign?

Hockey.

Hockey.

Field hockey.

Oh, okay.

Uhmm…

Cricket.

Cricket.

Cricket and soccer.

Soccer as well?

Yes.

Oh right.

And rugby.

OK.

Rugby too.

So the two Gaelic are the Gaelic football and the hurling?

Yes.

Right.

And for the girls, they call it Camogie but it’s played with a hurley stick.

Oh right. So they’ve got to be pretty tough girls? Is it, is it rough as well?

Well it’s, yeah it’s generally a rough game.

(Laughs) I haven’t ever heard of girls…Camo? Camogie?

Camogie.

Camogie.

Yeah.

Right, right. Well there’s another interesting photo here, uhm, of them at the birthplace of Guinness. But it doesn’t say where it is. Do you know…?

It’s in Dublin.

In Dublin. Okay.

At James’ Street. It’s known as the James’ Street Brewery.

Okay, and you’ve been there of course?

Many times.

(Laughs) What about you Mary?

I was there once.

And did you take a taste?

And I had a taste and they gave me a cookbook.

Cooking with Guinness.

Cooking with Guinness. Make Guinness cake…

Right.

…Guinness plum pudding, Guinness steak and kidney pie.

Have you ever made any of these things?

I made the cake and the pudding but I have never made the Guinness, uhm, steak and kidney pie.

The cake, it’s a fruit cake.

Yeah and can you taste the Guinness or?

Uhm no. You can’t but…

They say that Guinness is, well they advertise in Ireland "Guinness is good for you."

Guinness is good for you but I don’t care for the taste myself.

(Laughs).

But uhm, when I worked in the hospital, the patients who needed building up got a bottle of Guinness with their lunch every day.

Really?

Yeah.

So it’s, it’s got a lot of iron in it? That’s…

It’s got, it’s a meal in itself.

(Laughs)

(Laughs)

You’ve had a few of those meals in your day, Tom?

Yeah, many times. Uh, Guinness had a, a great sports, uhm, outfit. They played all games and they had a wonderful, ehm, ehm, area for playing in.

Hmm.

They had soccer, Gaelic football, hurling, tennis, lawn bowling, ehm, field hockey.

This was all like…

In the one…

… in Dublin…

Yes.

near, near the brewery.

Iveagh, Iveagh grounds.

Right.

It’s called after Lord Iveagh.

Lord Iveagh.

I…V…E…A…G…H.

Uhm, is it still there today? That…

Oh yes.

Yeah, those grounds.

Very popular.

Uhm hmm.

And you can have a few pints in the…they have a bar on the site.

Right.

Have a few of the best there.

Do you reckon the Guinness in Ireland is better than anywhere else? I mean, you can get it here in Canada but does it taste the same?

It’s the "Liffey Water." The river…

That beautiful Liffey water.

…the river Liffey. They call it a "Liffey Liqueur." A pint of Guinness.

So that makes the difference in the taste…

Yeah.

… in Ireland. Okay, uhm. I don’t know what else these photos are of, one, I think there’s one more. We talked about the Rock of Cashel. Oh, I know, there’s one here of the Post Office in Dublin.

Yes.

The General Post Office. And, uhm, Mark was saying that there was an exhibition there about the revolution.

Yes.

And there’s also the bullet holes in, in the post office itself.

Yes. You can see the, the bullet holes on the front and sides where, uhm, 1916 the, Padraig Pearce and his group took over the uh, post office and declared the Irish Constitution. Uhm, and the, the British brought their battleships up the Liffey and bombed it, but they held out for a few days there and uhm. Was it nine of them Mary were?

Four. Four.

Put to death. No trial.

Hanged.

Really?

Yes.

So. They, okay, they declared Ireland a republic but, but then the British took over again.

Oh yes.

So, so they weren’t successful.

But at least they started negotiating and uhm, in 19 uhm, 20, they signed what was called "The Irish Free State."

Okay.

For 26 of the 32 counties.

So…

The other 6 were partitioned; the 6 counties…

In the north.

Of the north, yeah.

What was, his name was Patrick Pearce?

Yes.

I, I, I’m surprised I’ve not heard that name before. I mean the other famous people you hear about are…

Well, Michael Collins.

Yeah.

He was also in the group and uhm, James Larkin.

James Connelly.

James Connelly, yeah. They were, they were leaders in uhm, but they teamed up with this, with the original IRA, The Irish Republican Army.

So they…

And they, they declared a republic. And the fact that they declared a republic, that really has haunted them up to the present day because the people in the North of Ireland, they, there was no way they wanted to have anything to do with a republic.

Hmm, hmm.

They wanted eh….

Monarchy. Monarchy.

Association with, with uh, Britain…and still do.

Well we can’t…

But it’s uhm, Dublin, eh, the post office in Dublin is really a famous meeting place.

Meeting for who?

For people coming from the country, if they have relatives in Dublin.

Oh, okay.

"I’ll see you at the post office."

Uh huh, uh huh.

And they know which post office they mean, you know.

The landmark.

Yeah.

There’s just the one.

Yeah, yeah. I guess, I, I mean was it damaged a lot du, during…

Oh yeah, yes.

…the, the, the revolution.

Yes.

So they had to rebuild it, to some, to some extent?

Well, the main, uh, façade of the place was never changed.

Okay.

But all the windows, all that stuff was damaged.

Uh hmm. So these, I mean, you were alive then but you were a kid. Do you…

Not in 1916.

No, he wasn’t born until 1920.

Oh (laughs)… sorry! Sorry!

(Laughs).

My maths, my maths isn’t very good. Uhm, so these stories were just told to you by…your father or…

My father, yeah.

Umm hmm.

He was around there then.

He wasn’t involved?

Well he…

Well, he was partly involved wasn’t he?

Yeah, he was teaching, uhm, Gaelic. He used teach Gaelic in the, eh, Gaelic League.

Oh.

And he was in, an, he was insulted when they suggested he should be paid for it.

(Laughs).

He figured that, that was his…

His duty.

…contribution.

Oh, okay. Right. So how did. I mean, how did he support the family though? Did he have another job as well or?

No but that, during that part there was a few weeks there that no one worked, they…

Oh, okay.

But they tried to block off all the main entries into Dublin where British outposts throughout the country would be erh. It happened on Easter Monday and that’s the day of the Fairy House Races, horse racing.

Umm, hmm.

And they figured that all the Brits would be down at eh, at Fairy House…

Uh huh.

…And this is when they made their first move, but were completely outnumbered, outgunned.

Hmm, so there’s no chance really. What about, uhm, as far as the, the talks today. You know, the peace talks in the North?

Well, it’s amazing how they’re proceeding. No one seems to want to give up and it looks as if the main item will be the disarmament…

Hmm.

…of all parties.

Yeah.

See they have eh, they have a police force, the Royal Ulster Constabulary, armed. They’re armed.

Yeah right.

And they’re 98% orange. Orangemen.

Yeah. Oh, so there are some non Orangemen in the…

Very few.

…Ulster?

If you joined the Royal Ulster Constabulary you were bad news.

(Laughs). Yeah.

That’s from the Catholic point of view.

I can ima…, I, I gathered that.

(Laughs). Yeah.

(Laughs).

Uhm.

But until the Irish Free State was formed the police force in the south of Ireland was also the Royal Irish Constabulary.

Uh hmm. Uh hmm.

An R.I.C. man was bad news with the Republicans.

Yeah. So, I mean that just doesn’t exist anymore, that, that R.I.C.?

No.

No. OK.

It’s called the Garda Siothana now.

And that, but that’s…

That’s Gaelic…

…but that’s the police, police force.

Yeah.

Right. Right. Oh well, I guess we hope that something comes…

Oh.

…of these talks.

Eventually.

They seem to be proceeding pretty well at the moment.

Well they formed…

People want peace over there now.

Okay Well, I think, eh, that’s a nice note to finish on. Thanks Mary. Thanks Tom.

You’re welcome.